Ramadan: council requests no eating at meetings

janet burton
Member - 88 posts

Respecting the religious practices of others means accepting them without comment and permitting them to carry them out without restraint, not joining them in their religious practice.
Certainly no-one has ever suggested we should not serve meat at business lunches during Lent to support Christians - which is the parrallel to what they are suggesting we should do to support muslims.
This is PC gone mad. Diversity does not mean everyone joining in minority practices, it means permitting minority practices.

Russell Bailey
Member - 1 post

Absolutely bonkers is this a wind up and have you all gone raving mad clearly in a Christian country, christian beleifs and way of life should remain and if Muslim'swish to practice their religion it should not have no way have any impact to our way of life same as the Christian or any other reglious belief should not impact on any other religeon.

Daniel Sweeney
Member - 24 posts

Presumably St Paticks day will now be a national holiday throughout the uk, all staff canteens will not be allowed to serve meat on Fridays, and no meetings will be held past sun down on a friday. But then again, the Irish, the catholics and the jews (or most other religious groups excepting fundamentalist christians) dont generally insist on imposing their world views on others. They may have a view and a strong one at that, on how society should behave but most ethnic and religious minorities dont seek to dominate a host society. With this growth in post modernity and the globalisation of acceptance of difference, I look forward to the time when regimental chaplains can wear religious insignia in Saudi Arabiua, the next time we are preventing their neighbours from invading them, and popping down to the pub in Riyadh for a pint.
This sort of nonsense creates fear and hostility and fuels the idiots of the far right.

Craig Stuart
Member - 109 posts

Quite right Daniel - too many idiots about if you ask me.

Russell - I'm no Christian and I would not want "christian beleifs and way of life" rammed down my throat either.

It's unfortunately another example of misguided, misthought-through positive discrimination.

Stephen Martin
Member - 13 posts

The lunatics have taken over the asylum - again.

I really do not believe for one single nano second that moderate and sensible Muslims have any wish to impose their religious practises upon the rest of us. The furore is caused by obsequeous individuals trying to curry favour with the extremists.

We are confusing the word integration, ably illustrated by Janey Burton earlier, with the word conformity.

Alex Gordon
Member - 24 posts

What is up with you people? All that is being asked is that during a period of fasting consideration is shown to those on fast. This is simply good manners, which at one time the English were famous for...

Kevin Brown
Member - 115 posts

No, what seems to be being asked is for non-Muslims to conform to the Muslim custom of fasting. Leaving asde the argument that a working lunch is a contradiction in terms (IMOH and frm wide experience if it's not an oxymoron it should be) there are extremely valid reasons why some people cannot fast for more than a few hours at a time. One of them is to allow diabetics to control their blood glucose levels, where snacking is an integral part of the control regime. Instead of ths heavyhanded PC approach perhaps it would have been more diplomatic to suggest that any meetings expected to last longer than 2 hours shoud incorporate a comfort break. (Comfort would have the widest possible interpretation). How would you reconcile fasting in a manufacturing workplace with ensuring that your workers took the required breaks and refreshed themselves appropriately? What if you considered that lack of refreshment was affecting productivity or the ability of the individual to work safely?
Religious observance is one thing, inclusion and tolerance of others' needs, expectations and rights is another. I promise to respect your doctrines, just keep your mitts off my Hobnobs.

Anne McAllister
Member - 165 posts

I also wonder at the wisdom of fasting in terms of general health and safety.
I also wonder at the wisdom of eating while at a meeting.

Stephen Smith
Member - 12 posts

Spot on Alex!

Gary Barbour
Member - 1 post

@Alex.

I disagree I don't think manners come into this! If I choose to follow a religion and its beliefs that is personal to me! If I choose to fast then again that is personal to me and my choice. I don't expect others to have to fast also as they also have the freedom of choice the same as me. One of the wonderful things of living in the UK.

I believe very strongly in equality. But it should be fair equality! I always feel in the UK things seem to be very sided towards minority groups. I notice councils ban Christmas Celebrations on the grounds of religion but enforce fasting under the name of religius equality. Its a strange UK we live in just now!

Carl Manning
Member - 23 posts

Cultural awareness and acceptance - Yes

Cultural imposition -No

Alex is correct to point out the 'request' is only one of courtesy, I fear like some others that the 'request' will quickly become an urban myth, like so many H&S issues.

I recently asked one of my team if it would help him to work 'flexibly' this month due the long daylight hours. The offer was appreciated, but he pointed out he would be causing 'trouble' and 'lone worker' issues, no trouble or lone workers I just come in to cover him and get some work done without the phone going!

The danger is surely the council could be accused of creating division rahter than their honourable attempt to promote integration

Stephen Smith
Member - 12 posts

For crying out loud why is this such a problem. The point is "Staff at a local council have been asked..." that is "asked" not ordered, demanded, or sacked if they don't comply (although you can't really sack an elected member)

Is it really too much for people, particularly elected members, who are representing the people of their community not to have a biscuit at their meeting!

Why is this such a problem?

Tim Blanchard
Member - 9 posts

Surely the world would be a better place if we respected each other's culture. This country is considered to be Christian, although multi-cultural. Those wishing to follow their own religion mostly do so without interference from outsiders. I've seen the Rosary peacefully on a bus, a middle eastern gentleman praying in the isle on a plane (post 9/11 with no problem) and Jews being offered and politely refusing ham sandwiches. (One said " I wish you'd not told me it was ham, because then I'd have been able to have one.")

This motion has most likely come someone outside of the Muslim faith, probably the only faith they have hear of is Adam Faith and I think they should consider how foreigners are treated in Muslim Countries before trying to change accepted eating habits of our own Nationals. There is a couple on trial today and faces a possible six year term in jail for the "crime" of kissing in public.

Pat Ward
Member - 1 post

It would have been better if the council concerned had not said anything - we've all managed perfectly well up to now during Ramamdam or Lent without such ridiculous edicts from the council.

To be honest, meetings without food would be far better as we would get so much more done and they probably wouldn't be so long!

Anita Morrison
Member - 2 posts

Although staff have been asked to show consideration- what will be the reaction of those fasting if people do not show it? will it cause tension? will those fasting be upset? I think, perhaps, that relationships may become strained as a result. Will people feel obliged to do what they have been asked so that they won't feel guilty?

I think there was no need for staff to be put into this awkward position. if someone chooses to fast then they must take the consequences. It is not for others to try to change the environment around them to assist them.

Molly Andrews
Member - 11 posts

Stephen, people like you are the problem because you assume that religion, whichever one, has a place in the office. It doesn't. Religion is something practiced by individuals in their own time and it should not be foisted on anyone else. If there is a meeting and some of the attendees don't want to eat then fine but those who normally do have refreshments at these meetings should be left to continue as before - not even asked. To do so is rude and ignorant of personal feelings on the subject of religion

Peter Daws
Member - 11 posts

Respect is all that is required. No more, no less.